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Am I in the Friend Zone?

Author: "Being a Man in a Woman's World"

"If you want to wait for her to tell you what to do next you'll remain a virgin forever. So far you've been doing everything wrong but I'm going to tell you what to do next."

Dear Doc,

I met this girl about 2 months ago in a college class. She actually seemed to show interest in me. I don’t know what her intentions were. She began by smiling at me in the library one day. Then she started to sit next to me sometimes and would make conversation with me in the halls.

As soon as she came into class, she would look back at me and do give this shy smile (which was rather strange, because she’s not a very "girly" type girl) but not say anything. Soon she started touching me on the shoulder, back, sometimes when she laughed she leaned her head on my shoulders.

She has hugged me twice and both of these times were when I walked her somewhere. I understand that some girls just want friendship but what kind of a girl tries so hard to be friends with a guy? She gave me her contact information without hesitation when I asked and whenever we chat online, it’s basically asking questions since we don’t know much about each other.

She has never mentioned any other guy in front of me. She usually talks about her classes or job or whatever. It’s strange because there’s this comfort and familiarity between us and she always acts very enthusiastic (which sometimes makes me think I’m in the friend zone) and yet I know only a few things about her and she barely knows anything about me.

I was wondering what I should do about this girl. She has told me about her class schedule. I don’t know if she was just making conversation or letting me know when she’s not busy. I have the option of "running into her" after one of her classes but I was just thinking if it would seem creepy or too aggressive. The main problem is: she seems like one of those girls who has a lot of guy friends and yet no boyfriend. I mean would she even want a relationship? Judging by what I know about her it’s hard to imagine that no one has ever asked her out before.

I'm thinking of asking her to grab lunch with me after one of her classes (we both get out at the same time and our classrooms are right next to each other). I was wondering what I should talk to her about that day...should I try to read her more...whether she wants a relationship and all that ...or if I should focus on expressing my interest in her? I keep getting all sorts of advice from people. Some say be direct before she loses interest, some say play hard to get, some GIRLS even told me to be her close friend first and then progress to a relationship (no amount of convincing will make me believe this is a good idea). To top it off, I don’t even know if she liked me. How should I go about getting this girl? 

Hello Mike!

Shit Mike. I'm just sitting here hanging my head. Are you planning on entering a monastery and becoming a monk? If you continue doing what you're doing now, you're absolutely, positively guaranteed to die a virgin. Good luck with that.

On the other hand...

You have so many huge mistakes here I just don't know where to even start with you!

I'm guessing you're in high school and by now you should have gained some knowledge to not be in this situation. If so, I'm going to try to open your eyes. If not, you're about to get some real perspective on things. I just hope you take this to heart.

Let's begin here: you have absolutely NO education whatsoever about women. You're now in a situation where you need some and you have none. I'm going to tell you what you should have learned by now, but that's not going to substitute for a real education because you're going to find yourself in 100 other situations where you're not going to know what to do.

When I tell you what you need to do, you're likely not going to do it either! Up until now, you've tried to get the wrong information from the wrong sources, listen to the wrong things and don't even try to understand what you're trying to learn.

Look, I'm not being hard on you simply to bust your chops. I'm expressing frustration here. What you don't understand this that this isn't about you at all. It's about this poor girl. You're actually harming her out of your ignorance. That's wrong Mike. She doesn't deserve this - all because you've avoided learning what you need to.

Here are at least some of the mistakes you're making (besides not knowing what you're doing):

1) Listening to girls, thinking that they'll ever really tell you what you want and need to know about other girls. They won't. That's because first, they don't date other women. They don't really know what works and they feel totally and completely comfortable telling you things that don't work because they don't know.

That whole playing hard to get thing? It doesn't work for them and it sure as hell won't work for you. Being a girl's friend? Are you kidding me? Is that all you want from her? Well, that's all you get if you even start hinting at that.

Even worse, they have absolutely NO motivation to help you! Do you think they'd do it because they're your "friend" or because they think you're a nice guy? Don't count on it! I can't tell you how many girls/women I've talked to that feel totally within their rights to mislead you! They actually think they're doing other girls a favor by screwing with you! That's not a joke Mike. It's a fact.

2) Worrying about whether she likes you or not. That's a total and complete waste of your time, but worse, it will prevent you from doing what you have to do to start actually dating ANY girl! You can turn interest (which this girl has in spades) into attraction, IF You know how to do it!

3) You are so worried about her liking you you're totally ignoring all the signals she's throwing at you! This girl is actually SCREAMING at you - and you're deaf to it!

4) You're waiting around instead of making a move - a REAL move. I'm not talking about "hanging out" like you're getting ready to do. That's what cowards and virgins do. That's now what men who are actually in the dating world do.

5) You have everything you need to pull the trigger, yet there to sit.

6) You're worried about whether she wants a relationship or not. Mike! Seriously? This is the sole purpose that women even live! However, far more important...

7) It makes NO difference WHAT she wants! YOU (as the man) control what you have with her - NOT HER! You're putting all of your own power into her hands and trust me on this one: she does NOT want it!

This poor girl is on the brink of giving up, and you're worried about what you'd say to her. Do you see the disconnect here? You and she are on totally different paths.

Go to my website ( and read my FAQ's (under "articles"). There, you'll find 3 articles linked that will tell you how to hold conversations.

Bottom line is this Mike: I've been pretty hard on you here. It might make you angry, it might hurt your feelings or it might push you over the edge to go get the knowledge you're going to need to have the rest of your life if you ever want to be successful with women. At the very least, hopefully, you'll stop focusing on the wrong things and get your head into the game. This girl has done everything in her power to try to get you to do this and you're still worried about whether she likes you or not.

Yes Mike. She likes you.

Best regards...
Dr. Dennis Neder

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Copyright (c) 2007-2012 Dr. Dennis W. Neder All rights reserved.
Dr. Dennis W. Neder
Author of: Being a Man in a Woman's World
Dedicated to advancing the arts and sciences of relationships.
Start having the relationships YOU deserve!
Got a love, relationship or man/woman question? I answer all letters. You can write to me at for answers. For more information about my book, "Being a Man in a Woman's World", visit: 

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